91: How studying songwriting makes you a better copywriter with Carolyn Barclay

We flagged down a Big Yellow Taxi and rode it all the way to Melbourne to catch copywriter and Joni Mitchell mega-fan, Carolyn Barclay, this week.  A stubbornly strategy-first copywriter, Carolyn helps brands sound like actual humans instead of soulless robots sent from the future to bore us to death. She’s also co-founder of Kingswood & Palmerston, a creative consultancy solving marketing puzzles for B2B and making ads for ad agencies. She talks to us on selling cheap suits to men who call them straitjackets, Bob Dylan, writing great copy by studying song writing, outspending versus outsmarting, why ordering ten blogs with a side of social is rarely the right thing to do, Eaon Pritchard, making ads for ad agencies, why rappers are good copywriters, whether AI robots really will take our jobs and a shed load more.  ///// Follow Carolyn on Twitter and LinkedIn  Check out her website  And Kingswood & Palmerston  Follow K&P on Twitter and LinkedIn too  Here’s David Moore’s collection of Ads for Ad Agencies  Carolyn recommends Eaon Pritchard’s Back to Basics course  Read Carolyn’s blog “How my failed songwriting career helps me write better copy” When Writing Sings by Gary Provost  To Leave Something Behind by Sean Rowe  Ads we chat about:  …Gasp! Turns 13 Life. Be in it.  Slip! Slop! Slap!  Backbone by Young & Rubicam  TDA Advertising & Design  Timestamps (01:45) - Quick fire questions  (03:12) - First job selling cheap suits  (07:50) - First marketing job organising Avon’s Bargain Bin catalogue (13:51) - Writing great copy by studying song writing  (18:46) - Why she’s a stubbornly strategy-first copywriter (23:59) - Kingswood & Palmerston (27:57) - Ads for ad agencies (34:07) - Listener Questions from John Lyons, Louis Lucente, Kate Taylor, and David Moore (34:29) - Why rappers make great copywriters  (39:20) - Thoughts on AI copywriting (44:39) - 4 pertinent posers Carolyn’s book recommendations are: Santaland Diaries by David Sedaris   Anything by Margaret Atwood    Miracle and Wonder: Conversations with Paul Simon by Malcolm Gladwell  Writing Better Lyrics by Pat Pattison    Junior by Thomas Kemeny  /////