#4: Dancing with systems in design for sustainability - Conny Bakker

In honour of her inauguration as professor in Design Methodology for Sustainability & Circular Economy,  Ianus Keller talks with Conny Bakker about the Champions League of sustainable design, digging for world views, why the dinosaurs have had their time and dancing with systems. References in this episode: Stephen Gould: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Jay_Gould Donella H. Meadows - Thinking in systems: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3828902-thinking-in-systems Notion: https://www.notion.so/